LOGOPOLIS and the FINAL SEASON

[Prydonian]

Hey everyone, Prydonian is back. Thanks for having me. I just finally bought the Logopolis DVD tonight and was wondering what the fans here think of Tom's last proper Who story and finale year in general?

[MCH]

I have watched Logopolis twice now and I must say that I don't quite get something. When the Doctor was hanging on to the structure just before he fell it almost looked like he just decided to drop.

Now I guess he could have just been tired from battling the Master, or perhaps he realized that it was just his time to go. 'shrugs'. But I was surprised that he just let go and dropped.

Then there is that whole bit about the pale guy that was supposed to be him? Why did that pale guy follow him around? Do Time Lords usually have a future self help out like that?

Also, that pale guy had spent time in the TARDIS before Tom's Doctor bought it. Did the pale guy set out that clothes for Doctor #5? When Peter Davidson's Doctor was looking for a new outfit he saw that clothes set out for him or at least it seemed that way.

Seeing Doctor #5 in Tom's big coat, scarf and hat was really amusing.

MCH

[pattie anne]

dear MCH -

i always thought that too. the doctor just let go. always wondered WHY.

no, not usually. but when was the olde doc ever a usual TIme Lord? still, another Time Lord (Cho-Je/K'Anpo) got doc #4 going so i always figured it completed his cycle thus closing the circle by a future self doing the very same thing. [very mid-east mysticism here. ]

and i never put that particular 2 and 2 together, but being (or having been) the #5 doc, The Watcher would know what this particular doctor was to prefer. and i can see the doctor's particualr sense of humor coming forth in The Watcher laying out his clothes for him.

though many fans did not like the story, i thought it was a very fitting and proper end to TOM's era.

Seeing Doctor #5 in Tom's big coat, scarf and hat was really amusing.

yes. too bad they got the boots/shoe thing wrong. AND not to forget ... he unravelled The Scarf! the callous wretch!

best.
pattie anne

[tch]

I think they never really explained the Watcher/Pale guy in more than the vaguest terms.

I look at him like I do the mystery woman in 'End of time', in that whatever the viewer decides is the real story.

I think they should do a set of regeneration action figures which features each Doctor wearing the outfit of the Doctor he took over for. I know they did one for David Tennant's Doctor, and possibly Peter Davidson, but I want all 11.

[MCH]

greetings all,

The other day I was looking at the website for the stamp center that Tom does signings at and in there was a section on action figures where I saw something wonderful !

It was a set of figures from the Pandorica series. First, Matt Smith (Doctor #11) is shown in his bow tie outfit wearing the Fez and holding the mop. I LOVE the scene where Amy Pond takes the Fez off the Docs head and it is then blown to bits by River. 'squeal'. There also is Amy and a Roman and a weeping angel. And...

Oh how I want that set ! But...

I have the Matt Smith Doctor figure in Doc 10's outfit. Hmmm, I'll need to check around and see if there are other cross dressers, lol.

As for the Watcher, I guess it's just going to be one of those cling on type things that just kinda hangs around to maybe have something done about it later. or not.

Mch

[Toothy Grin]

I think Logopolis is an excellent final story for Tom, he gets to save the entire universe so you can't really get much more of a heroic last act than that, can you? The story is very clever and thought-provoking, as well as very atmospheric with terrific music, Anthony Ainley's Master is a creepy foe for the Doctor and Tom gives a great final performance. The concept of the Watcher is brilliant as well.
Tom's last season is very atypical of his overall style of stories, with little humour, very serious and scientific and the updated music and titles give it a much more 80's feel, while Tom is very subdued throughout compared to his previous madcap lunatic style, and you also get the loss of Romana and K9 and the introducing of the juvenile companions so for these reasons it's not the most popular of seasons but there is much to recommend in Season 18, and all of the stories are well above average.

[Prydonian]

As per the Watcher, I wonder if it was the Time Lords on Gallifrey who sent him into the Doctor's relative past to warn him of the impending doom caused by the Master?

[Jagged]

There's a lot that's interesting about Tom's finale. The Chinese Box theme is something that always left me wanting for more. If the Tardis can land within the Tardis and make some infinite loop of realities within realities, that should make everybody wonder, including Daniel Galouye and Fassbinder. Further, if Reality is created in Logopolis by a sort of secretaries working their fingers off, what does that mean to our reality? That George W. Bush was really intended for good, but just one letter was misspelled?

[hackenbush]

I like Logopolis...up to a point. It's nicely doom-laden and has a real sense of occasion for a Doctor's final story...I just don't think it's the right sense of occasion for this particular Doctor's final story. Logopolis is certainly better written and more focused than Planet of the Spiders, with less bad acting and desperate padding. It's tighter and more strongly about the Doctor than the War Games or the Tenth Planet. But... Planet of the Spiders and, for the most part, War Games were excellent final stories for their respective Doctors as they had something to say about all that had gone before. Pertwee's send-off was nicely fitting, with his pride being his downfall in a way. Troughton's Doctor finally faces monsters he cannot face down, and is actually done away with by his own people. Tom, sadly, gets a story that is not terribly reminiscent of the best of what came before. It doesn't really let him demonstrate all that he can do, although he acts the impending doom well, and the Master's plan is sillier than anything in the seventeenth season. It's sad that this wonderful Doctor meets his end surrounded by a load of kids we don't yet really care for, accompanied by music that is not at all suited to his style and in a story that seems to think more of scientific technobabble (and that is all it is...Bidmead's "real science" being a whole lot less grounded in reality than a lot of Douglas Adams' material) than it does of character. So, yes, I like Logopolis as a story and even enjoyed the audio book when it came out recently, but it's actually hard to think of it as a Tom Baker/fourth Doctor story and that really shows the lack of love that the production team of the time had for the most successful Doctor to date. It's the kind of sad and unnecessary contempt that sometimes makes me think they deserved their downfall in the 1980s...

[metalheadjay]

Baker's last season is hit and miss with me. I like how serious and atmospheric it is but I really miss Baker's humor and witty adlibbing. It seems to me as if he was being held back by John Nathan-Turner. His creative control was being stifled. It's to be expected for the final two connecting stories(Keeper and Logopolis) because of the inevitable conclusion but the earlier stories would have been far more entertaining if Baker was allowed to ham it up a bit more.

It's awfully hard for me to watch "Logopolis" due to the obvious end result. It saddens me and I tend to tear up(however I think the Doctors demise should have been more dramatic and drawn out a bit more) . I wanted Baker to play the role for another two or three seasons being that the writing was quite good up 'til 1984 and he was clearly still on top of his game. However, there are many good justified reasons as to why Baker left. Turner and the production team(at that time) were hellbent on ruining everything that was good about the show. Just being brutally honest.